EP4: Keep the Human in the Loop: Building Customer Trust in the Age of AI

00:00:05: Welcome back.

00:00:05: We are back here on the Zoom In On CX podcast with myself, Ben Nioh.

00:00:10: I lead Zoom CX here in Amir and i am delighted to be joined by Lee Hopwood who is the CEO of The CCMA.

00:00:18: Hi

00:00:18: Lee!

00:00:19: Hi, thanks for having me

00:00:21: No problem.

00:00:22: Lee first question For our audience what does a CCMA do before we get into

00:00:27: topic?

00:00:28: That's good question.

00:00:30: um...in essence the profession, we're here to support the contact centre industry.

00:00:36: But a big mission that we have is to help modernise society's perception of our industry because it has changed so much

00:00:44: from

00:00:44: what people think it is and what it actually is today.

00:00:48: So were on bit of a mission.

00:00:49: Wow!

00:00:50: That was a big Mission as well Because its'a Big Topic And Actually... Todays topic is all around trust being a differentiator in this you know, customer experience world and every sort of fast set of it around there.

00:01:06: So what are you seeing across your CCMA community only?

00:01:10: Do you feel we're entering into a trust economy now as part of the CX World?

00:01:16: Yeah I do!

00:01:18: It's an interesting time when you think about what has happened over the last few years –and i don't want to become an historian in this- and linger on the past– but You look at the geopolitical landscape and the impact that's having on us as individuals, as consumers.

00:01:38: And

00:01:38: actually there is a real craving of humans to want to trust people.

00:01:45: That for me is kind of underlying why trust has now become more important in business.

00:01:52: One of things we've done recently... We launched some research with support from you guys at Zoom.

00:02:00: that's looking at what do contact center consumers look for.

00:02:04: So the consumers of contact centre services and it is fascinating to hear, we agree with a sentiment about out there in market but customer service perceived as getting better.

00:02:20: certainly five years monitoring from contacts into perspective so this purely contact centre service and it's getting better.

00:02:29: Therefore, there is a real opportunity for us to lean into that and make sure we continue to build the trust that we are starting to see when people get in touch with contact centres?

00:02:44: That was really interesting because all of the periods before... We've always heard about decline in customer experience.

00:02:54: I don't think the need for trust has ever gone away.

00:02:56: That's clearly good at the core of everything, but it's really interesting to hear that your research is showing there was an uptick or certainly a increase improvement in customer experience and you'd assume therefore the trust in knowing people are going be wanting do what would put down too?

00:03:14: Maybe not necessarily.

00:03:15: some other things might see out there building on trust.

00:03:21: Yeah, well actually just thinking into the research.

00:03:23: Actually our acceptance of self-service is strengthening and as consumers there's a great deal more confidence in digital.

00:03:38: And when you think that AI Is out there we've all got never

00:03:42: heard of it Lee

00:03:45: You're sure But if its not there We are going through this this journey of trying to work it out and accept it.

00:03:56: And I think that, well certainly what i'm seeing and hearing from members is AI's there.

00:04:04: we're using it but its opened our eyes to doing better self-service and using the digital channels better!

00:04:13: You know...I have been known to talk about AI being our third car crash So the first one being general contact centers.

00:04:23: It's fine, I know you can't always get through to a person but we've got brilliant IVR.

00:04:27: We put that in thought.

00:04:28: it was going to be groundbreaking from a customer service perspective and now we've Got this reputation of press one for this press two for them.

00:04:36: The second Car crash with chatbots.

00:04:41: so right will abandon the IVR?

00:04:42: Will bring in the chat box and have a conversation with you And and That doesn't work Trust between a consumer or buyer and the contact center Can be eroded because they don't trust that The conversation, the contact.

00:05:00: The interaction That They're going to have is gonna Be A quality one.

00:05:03: but it's all right Because AI Is Going To Come In And It'S Gonna Take Over The Chatbot.

00:05:07: An All Is Gonna Be Fine But We've... AI I Think Is Is The Catalyst For Trust Coming Back On The Agenda Because There's loads of different demographics that will see things in a different way.

00:05:23: AI could absolutely put trust on steroids if consumers believe the information they're being told from an AI bot, but we can absolutely harm it.

00:05:42: what's being said by the AI bot.

00:05:45: And that for me is where human interaction, it still important and I've said at other day we need to keep humans in a loop.

00:05:55: this lovely phrase one of those on our finger cards if doing anything industry but actually not out of nostalgia so aware sounding like stuck in the eighties because people are front line.

00:06:12: We don't need them out

00:06:18: of nostalgia.

00:06:18: I think what we are seeing as well is that AI absolutely plays a part, you know?

00:06:22: I've got teenage children and they only want to deal with digital channels until it gets to a point where there's actually something quite complex or... Actually!

00:06:34: They just want a little bit of hand-holding through the process.

00:06:38: And therefore, you know going from an AI led chatbot which probably can do the majority of what they want to.

00:06:44: But actually going over to a human when I spoke with my son because he's just started driving so i asked him go and research insurance not gonna stuff?

00:06:52: He had lots of questions!

00:06:53: He'd never done it before around there...he only wanted to speak to a Human Because he wasn't trustful at the quotes that he was getting maybe cause he didn't trust himself putting the right information in.

00:07:03: So of kind-of handholding and feeling good about somebody coming in.

00:07:08: And actually, things like we were at a dinner the other day and I think it was yourself or someone who's talking about purposeful friction within the customer journey to build trust... Do you want us just sort of share a little bit?

00:07:19: Or expand on that?

00:07:20: really?

00:07:20: so because i think that is quite interesting thing.

00:07:24: We don't hear about friction from customers experience but there are no frictions!

00:07:28: But some friction is good Yeah, and

00:07:29: some friction really is good.

00:07:32: And especially around building trust.

00:07:35: So if you think about all of the different interactions that you might have I hope i don't do anybody a disservice But in the retail space.

00:07:47: it's shorter sharper conversations.

00:07:49: It might be aware as my order That kind of stuff You could be providing an AI service through, and you want that to be as frictionless as possible.

00:08:02: You want some security maybe around address details personal information but you want it to be a friction less as possible?

00:08:09: The retail space doesn't have big margins.

00:08:13: they can't afford someone on the end of their phone to answer where's my stuff?

00:08:17: kind of question part in our contact center family and you go to a bank.

00:08:26: And suddenly as the consumer if u want to be moving money around all you wanna be checking anything at round money.

00:08:35: it's such an emotive conversation that if i do anything about me you want some reassurance.

00:08:42: but there is something.

00:08:43: controls in place but there are some checks.

00:08:47: If you can easily move five grand from one place to another without any questions, that has actually happened.

00:08:56: and if I was able do it really easy could Ben phone my bank?

00:09:04: That for me is something that leans into a topic of conversation we've had recently around AI calling.

00:09:13: So that first piece and that friction peace is important.

00:09:19: We've been debating, especially in insurance

00:09:23: what

00:09:23: happens if an AI bot from a consumer puts a call-in to your contact center looking for the best insurance deal?

00:09:36: The best mortgage that's available has explicit consent to be able to work on behalf of the customer.

00:09:48: As a contact center, do you trust that bot?

00:09:53: And so my

00:09:54: trust

00:09:54: can go.

00:09:55: and this is why one of the reasons I think trust is really going to put under spotlight because what AI could both from company perspective, but also from a consumer perspective and that having friction purposeful friction.

00:10:13: That helps to build up that trust help to build.

00:10:19: Trust is there to help their trust in confidence.

00:10:23: yeah

00:10:23: actually an organization of brand knows what it's doing

00:10:27: And it has a direct consequence, doesn't it?

00:10:29: You know all that kind of I think purposeful friction but just sort of like double checking which is probably the other word for it.

00:10:35: Making sure you do want to do this again.

00:10:38: i feel Like That Is Something The Human Person Would Ask Me Anyway If I Was Doing This Anyway.

00:10:44: So Actually Do I Want To Do This?

00:10:47: if I Look At My Parents They Always Want A Little Bit Of Reassurance and Double Checking And when you look at that, you're more likely to feel comfortable with the brand and knock-on effect.

00:10:58: If we look all of stats – eighty percent people who are loyal or trusted will stay loyal for a lot longer.

00:11:08: There's these elements which have natural consequences too Which in business world can be difficult to quantify as soft subject like trust But actually through brand loyalty and retention of people, lack-of-journ maybe the same kind thing.

00:11:25: There are big business benefits to trust aren't there?

00:11:28: A member was telling me that they have interactions going through on digital channels but when it is dealing with larger amounts money They end up phoning the contact centre to speak to a human to confirm that transaction has happened.

00:11:47: So there is a and I think it's an industry week.

00:11:50: We're gonna go through this journey as consumers start to trust self-serve more they start to Trust AI more.

00:11:58: so, you know the trust from those digital pathways And and the friction that goes in their helps to build that trust.

00:12:07: but his consumers get used to more Digital stuff that works.

00:12:13: because that's the trick is those digital processes have got to work, then our trust will grow.

00:12:20: And and the danger there if we push too many people down digital routes to have conversations with a brand?

00:12:30: Then are we losing the opportunity to build that relationship with that consumer or

00:12:37: customer?".

00:12:39: Because as much I know AI, digital has a super huge place in our industry.

00:12:46: We are humans and we have connections and we like to talk to people And that's innate.

00:12:54: That's been around for centuries.

00:12:55: I think it will be really hard To break within the matter of years.

00:13:05: Yeah, yeah I agree.

00:13:06: We all like the human connection right?

00:13:07: You go into your coffee shop or whatever.

00:13:08: if you've been there a few times someone recognizes by name gives you same order and so on...I like that!

00:13:13: That's really nice.

00:13:14: it makes me want to back because you feel valued And i think we're just innately sort of programmed.

00:13:23: to be curious but certainly in customer service world is to be extra.

00:13:30: I don't like to say that, but you know there are different things that enable people feel warmth.

00:13:35: Feel empathy.

00:13:36: a bit of humour very British we can introduce in certain circumstances.

00:13:42: those kind of thing is difficult to replicate with AI.

00:13:44: however what might be doing around the scenes?

00:13:47: it's all really hard stuff actually prevented from before.

00:13:50: so maybe try and find information or actually having a compliance statement on hand because you know, you've got to do it and read out certain points.

00:13:57: And I remember when I was an agent that all the bits are stressed about because they had to say some things at certain times.

00:14:02: but if i could be reminded of them right time or actively.

00:14:07: proactively say it's because this is the system has told me something about his person.

00:14:13: in being proactive I'm bringing an authentic version of myself, and probably that's more than a fantastic version of the brand as well.

00:14:20: That is why it was employed at that time to do that.

00:14:23: so you know there are definitely no AIs not going away.

00:14:30: The year of AI augmentation they say in our industry but being helpful is what should be rather then owning entirely around them.

00:14:40: Are

00:14:41: Yeah, completely.

00:14:43: I talked about it the other day.

00:14:44: we're in the world of AI maturity We've gone from... It's going to transform us and be great isn't?

00:14:52: To prove who owns or governs it Who is responsible when decisions aren't as we think they're going to be, and I've always seen AI in four buckets.

00:15:03: The one that we talked a little bit about today is around putting it in front of the customer supporting CX – That's the biggest risk!

00:15:12: And this is the hardest to tackle but could deliver some brilliant gains if you get it right.

00:15:20: If other three buckets for me are doing what?

00:15:25: making sure that we're using AI to make the interactions with a human better.

00:15:32: So, giving the human support they need in order to have an authentic conversation as you said and then got all of the right information around them... You've then gotten the bucket of processing at the old robotic process optimization.

00:15:55: use AI to do things so much better.

00:15:58: So much quicker, so much

00:16:00: slicker.".

00:16:01: And then for me the other bucket and one that I think more brands or contact centres can do is use AI surface.

00:16:13: what customers are telling us?

00:16:17: what's happening when a customer not just interacts with us, it is about the contact centre interactions.

00:16:24: What do they talk to the store?

00:16:26: What are they use of products and go through an insurance policy?

00:16:32: or can we find out from customers that help make change elsewhere?

00:16:36: so there will be impact on our experience in other parts which helps build trust.

00:16:41: So this is where I feel like it always comes back to trying to build trust through all of these different mechanisms.

00:16:52: Yeah, we call... We're talking about a connected experience.

00:16:56: It's taking all those elements which previously before were disparate and connecting them together but learning from the insights that are already delivering because i bet something in the back office will have an impact on something at the contact centre.

00:17:10: Those kind of things.

00:17:11: Brightly, I'm going to ask you one final question.

00:17:14: Of course we're gonna speak again but the final question on this podcast is like if... So If We Are Talking About Trust Being The New Differentiator In CX What's The One Thing That Customer Leaders Should Start Doing To Sort of Set Themselves Up For The Future?

00:17:31: To Gain Trust?

00:17:33: Do You Know Me Well Enough Ben?

00:17:36: that i Can't Answer?

00:17:37: With One Thing It's going to be a barrage of things.

00:17:43: The first is I'm gonna lean on the insights, use the insights to make change elsewhere in the business.

00:17:48: but more than that and reason they say that it because its thing like policies ,it seems like processes .

00:17:58: Because if things outside contact center can impact us building trust through customer contacts What I would love to see organizations doing more of a lot them already are but and doing more off do what you say, you're gonna Do in the timely friendly manner And being open and honest with customers.

00:18:26: We did some research couple years ago.

00:18:28: And using proactive contact To inform customers that they can save money with you get access to other services from you.

00:18:40: That really helps to build trust.

00:18:44: and one of the things that's in the research we've recently launched is, The piece around vulnerable customers.

00:18:53: And what makes me super nervous Is every vulnerable customer whether it's their vulnerable because of finance or health Because they are a carer.

00:19:04: They're just going through tough times of a major life event, they all have individual needs when they make contact with you.

00:19:15: if they make contacts.

00:19:17: So might not even contact because just can't deal.

00:19:22: what's going on And that for me is how do we build that trust with those vulnerable customers?

00:19:28: I've loved hearing some of our members who work a lot with vulnerable people, councils and housing associations.

00:19:36: I love the fact they are doing proactive outreach to find out what it's like as a result getting this great engagement.

00:19:49: try to summarise what's that one thing, the contact centre leaders can do.

00:19:55: To really help build trust use the insights you've got.

00:20:01: Fantastic Lee!

00:20:03: That has been amazing.

00:20:04: Lee we have stuck for time as well so thank-you for that.

00:20:07: I

00:20:08: cannot believe it either.

00:20:11: Thank you so much for your time.

00:20:12: Absolutely brilliant, always some real pearls of wisdom in there.

00:20:15: and it's awesome because You're not just giving an individual's view... ...you are giving a member's group as well the sort of collection of views that you'll hear back from even perspectives which is amazing.

00:20:25: So Lee thank you ever so much And we will speak again.